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    Factorio Why are the fish doing this?

    June 30, 2021

    Factorio Why are the fish doing this?

    Why are the fish doing this?

    Posted: 30 Jun 2021 04:45 AM PDT

    Is there any functional difference between these 2 intersections, or is it just aesthetical?

    Posted: 29 Jun 2021 03:42 PM PDT

    Did you know biters can start fires

    Posted: 29 Jun 2021 07:06 PM PDT

    I'm only here cause SrGrapho posted something. How am I about to ruin my life by buying this game?

    Posted: 29 Jun 2021 05:23 PM PDT

    The topic says it all. I'm just putting some more words in if there's some sub rules about question length.

    submitted by /u/rob132
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    "Handyland" - Early game mall (for AAI industry)

    Posted: 29 Jun 2021 09:24 PM PDT

    PSA to anyone new to the game

    Posted: 29 Jun 2021 10:09 PM PDT

    Please do not start copying blueprints from the net, it will kill all your enjoyment of the game!

    submitted by /u/salluks
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    Finally I can get some peace [take two]

    Posted: 30 Jun 2021 05:31 AM PDT

    is there a way to force trains to travel on a schedule by (in-game or system) clock?

    Posted: 30 Jun 2021 02:26 AM PDT

    let's say i want a train to leave station A at sunrise (in-game), and leave station B at sunset (in-game)

    is there a way to do that?

    what about something more complex? what if i want a train to go to its next station when the system clock hits a unit of round numbers in the minutes digit? (so at xx.10, xx.20, etc)?

    i couldn't find anything by searching and i suspect this is impossible, but factorio has surprised me before so i wanted to check

    submitted by /u/Materia_Engine
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    Bachelor Thesis: "Verification of Factorio Belt Balancers using Petri Nets"

    Posted: 30 Jun 2021 06:10 AM PDT

    During 2020 I managed to convince a prof to accept my bachelor thesis (https://tuprints.ulb.tu-darmstadt.de/id/eprint/17621) about Factorio! To be more specific I wrote about the verification of Belt Balancers using so called Petri Nets and I though some of you might be interested in that. Petri Nets itself are graph like structures with a rather simple core principle, but you can still model nearly anything with them. You can use them to model e.g. network protocols, chemical reactions or a cookie vending machine. Additionally it is rather simple to formulate and verify properties for those Nets, for example with linear temporal logic and a model checker like SPIN (does not work in my case due to limitations of the SPIN interpreter I used, but more on that in the thesis).

    I used Petri Nets to create a modular model for Belt Balancers by modelling a splitter and creating some communication modules to move stuff from one splitter to another deterministically. With such a model in place I also propose some properties and their definitions for e.g. throughput unlimited or universal balancers. Last but not least I also describe a possible way to verify those properties automatically. But as I already mentioned I was not able to actually test those verifications properly and since time was rather limited I could not read deeply enough into another tool for this part.

    ​

    If you do not know what Petri Nets are and want to learn more about them from a professional I highly recommend "Understanding Petri Nets: Modeling Techniques, Analysis Methods, Case Studies" by Wolfgang Reisig. While it is published by Springer (yay /s) I'm sure you can find a copy somewhere. But I'll also do my best to give a short explanation about the basics.

    Petri Nets are bipartite, directed graphs. Bipartite means there are two "kinds" of vertices, namely places (denoted by circles) and transitions (denoted by boxes). Additionally edges may only occur between two different kinds of vertices, i.e. between a place and a transition. Edges between two places or two transitions are not allowed. Those graphs are also directed, since the edges actually go from somewhere to somewhere.

    With this said we can now talk about those things which make Petri Nets so useful. First, places can contain tokens, and those tokens can represent anything. For example if you want to model a vending machine you can use multiple types of tokens where a money tokens represents coins, soda tokens for available soft drinks and snack tokens for those chips and stuff the machine is selling. Tokens might also represent something more abstract, like the state of some protocol or they might be used to control the behavior of the Petri Net itself. Since I am only using simple Petri Nets for the Belt Balancer models, and for the sake of simplicity, I only use one kind of tokens. Those tokens may now be moved around with the help of transitions. To be more specific, if for a given transition each input place (place with an edge from that place to the transition) contains at least one token the transition may fire. If the transition fires it consumes one token from each input place and creates a new one at each output place (place with an edge from the transition to that place). And you might see already how this could be used to model how Belt Balancers move items around. Just take an input place for each Belt Balancer input, the same for the outputs and add a transition for each possible way an item might move. However Petri Nets are non deterministic, and with this first approach our model might move all input tokens to a single output, or it might not. And while such an uncertainty is pretty useful for modelling e.g. data loss during data transfers splitters and therefore Belt Balancers are rather deterministic. This means during the modeling process I spent a lot of time figuring out how to expand this basic, non deterministic Petri Net to make it deterministic. While there are Petri Net extensions to priorities certain transitions over others and a lot of other fancy stuff I wanted to stick to simple Petri Nets. Now, if you want to know how this could be done there is a certain bachelor thesis with a lot of spaghetti graphs you might want to read.

    If you have any questions, please, feel free to ask them. I'll gladly answer / discuss all of them. It just might take some time.

    submitted by /u/ALoTron_
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    Rather proud of this upgrade. Gave me a warm fuzzy feeling

    Posted: 29 Jun 2021 06:27 PM PDT

    Ruined the game for myself by learning about ratios

    Posted: 30 Jun 2021 06:13 AM PDT

    So I've played this game for about 50 hours now and I'm currently on purple/yellow science. Around 20 hours in, I realised that the most efficient way to build a factory is to calculate optimal ratios for every single thing you produce, and then scale up the ratios depending on how much of the stuff you need.

    Around 40 hours in I discovered the concept of the main bus (I discovered this on my own), and realised that it's much easier to over-produce the more common materials and have a main channel that carries them, and then having branches for the more niche productions.

    Learning about ratios and main buses has kind of ruined the game for me because I feel like even the most efficient base would use some combination of the two. My playtime currently consists of either calculating ratios or expanding my main bus, and it's getting boring really fast. Has anyone else experienced this?

    submitted by /u/copespammer
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    After some of your tips, I completely remade my factory, now it no longer looks like a bowl of spaghetti.

    Posted: 29 Jun 2021 07:42 PM PDT

    Commander, we have successfully achieved 98% containment of the Red Zone. Decontamination procedures are currently underway. While complete annihilation of the infestation is top priority, I urge you to utilize what you can for valuable resources. We can turn this area back into a Blue Zone.

    Posted: 29 Jun 2021 09:37 PM PDT

    Help

    Posted: 30 Jun 2021 07:27 AM PDT

    currently I fully researched all blue science things and there are too much biters that attack me. I need to focus on my defence but if they keep attacking me my factory wont grow :( the problem is I replaced all my turrets with laser turrets and they need a lot of electric. I'm too busy with repairing laser turrets and walls that I can't even automate things and increase my electric production so what do I need to do?

    submitted by /u/eaysofficiall
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    That urge to restart and reorganize upon reaching the need for blue science should be classified as the fifth fundamental force in the universe. For it is strong.

    Posted: 30 Jun 2021 08:05 AM PDT

    My First Circuit

    Posted: 29 Jun 2021 11:37 PM PDT

    My First Circuit

    Made my first circuit on my server, It Identifies the train and what its carrying and then determines what inserter to turn on. It also holds the next train until all items have been sorted to there respective chests so that they don't mix.

    https://preview.redd.it/yolk19n2mc871.png?width=2560&format=png&auto=webp&s=f63f6d6975f7dfae38bc69d05727b396688a89ca

    submitted by /u/hydramans
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    Best ways to work around the gaping hole in the circuit number line?

    Posted: 30 Jun 2021 02:09 AM PDT

    Zeros are seriously fucking with me. I really was not expecting to have so much trouble with circuits, but clearly I had not thought enough about how zeros are(n't) handled. So far these are my only real ideas for dealing with being unable to distinguish between a zero signal and an unset signal. I'd be really happy to see any other tricks, or ways of thinking about circuits.

    • N+1. Just slap a constant combinator next to the source and set the signal of interest to 1. With some luck, one more or less won't matter at all and you can just forget about it. Otherwise, it should be easy enough to adjust for.

    • Default to less-than behavior, use greater-than signal to inhibit. This is a very recent idea so I haven't played with it much at all yet. There might be looming problems. But the basic idea is that when wanting to handle greater-than- or less-than-X, instead of trying to trigger some behavior when you detect the less-than-X condition, just default the behavior in. Stop the behavior when you detect you're actually in the greater-than condition. I think this should work fairly well, but I wouldn't be too surprised if attempting this in more complex situations forced you to repeatedly twist your mind in knots. It's certainly not my initial way of looking at solutions, but I think it has some promise.

    • Uh... yeah. That's all I got. It's a bit pitiful. So uh, what else is there?

    submitted by /u/sdfgsdfggsd
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    I guess Factorio made a new fan?

    Posted: 29 Jun 2021 02:56 PM PDT

    Train signals - multi trains on a single section in the same direction

    Posted: 30 Jun 2021 04:57 AM PDT

    I'm new to the game and I've hit a bit of a learning-speed-bump with trains and signals. I think I'm getting how signals work after a few YouTube videos and the tutorial.

    However, I'm not sure how to set up signals to prevent trains running into each other AND also allow for multiple trains running on the track in the same direction.

    For example - I have a large ore body outside of the base. I run a single long track to my mining outpost with a loop at either end. I can set up my signals to prevent head on collisions, but this will also prevent two trains running in the same direction on the tracks.

    Is this just trying to do things the game can't allow?

    submitted by /u/maxjohnathan
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    Behold my insanity! Buffered & beaconed train-to-train foundry (hopefully UPS optimized)

    Posted: 29 Jun 2021 04:30 PM PDT

    Behold my insanity! Buffered & beaconed train-to-train foundry (hopefully UPS optimized)

    Hello fellow engineers.

    I am in the preparations to go properly megabase, which means 2 things for me: Learning how to use trains, and optimize my builds for UPS. Therefore I have spent some time in sandbox mode trying to find ways to smelt with as little "moving parts" that can potentially cost UPS.

    Rather than looking for ready to paste blueprints, I decided to give it a shot myself. The objective was simple: Make a build with trains full of ores coming in, and full of plates going out, minimizing the number of elements for UPS optimization. I've let my imagination run wild and this post details the results of my research insanity.

    Let's think about the absolute minimum: I'm going to need a furnace and 2 inserters to take things in and out. Ideally no belts, splitters, circuit network, etc... To keep these restriction to their strict minimum, a ridiculous solution that came immediately to mind was to stick 2 train tracks next to each other like with the foundry in between like this:

    Minimalist train to train foundry

    Despite being extremely minimalist, which should be good for UPS, this design has lots of downsides. First, it would take ages to smelt, although this could be solved by adding more foundries in parrallel and more trains, possibly also replacing productivity modules by speed modules (I don't care about ore depletion at mining productivity >100 anyway). Second, this system is unbuffered, which means that if the ore train leaves, the smelting stops (if the plates train leaves the furnace itself can buffer up to 100 plates though). Also if using this system at scale to provide for an entire megabase, it might take quite a lot of space due to the number of smelting-stations required.

    So I started looking for ways to improve this basic idea, trying to reduce the number of furnaces and inserters with beacons, and also find a way to have some buffering so the smelting never stops, even when there are no trains while they switch. This is what I came up with:

    Buffered & beaconed train to train foundry

    Let's have a closer look at a single unit that handles 1 wagon:

    Smelting unit handling 1 ore wagon

    One red inserter takes the ore out and puts it in the ore buffer chest, a stack inserter then take the ore from the chest and feeds the furnace, and is then taken out by a stack inserter into a plate buffer chest, and a final inserter puts it into the plate train wagon.

    In terms of speed, we're getting closer to something actually usable here: The furnace has 8 beacons full of speed modules and its own modules. With production modules, it runs at crafting speed 9.4 (+370%), and with speed modules instead it runs at crafting speed 12 (+500%). In other words, this setup gives the furnace the same speed than a classic setup like the following:

    A classic beaconed smelting setup with same speed, for reference

    For the buffering issue, it's completely sorted. Even though we are using a slower red inserter to get the ores, the ore buffer fills up, even when the furnace has speed modules 3 instead of production modules 3.

    We are now using 4 inserters per wagon instead of 6 and only 1 furnace rather than 2, with the addition of 2 chests and 8 beacons (which if I understand correctly should impact our UPS less than having more inserters and furnaces).

    I have implemented a miniaturized version of this system in sandbox mode with an ore loading station and a plate unloading station to let this system run and see it in action and it doesn't look as insane as it first did. Here is a screenshot of it:

    Miniaturized version of the train to train froundry

    On the bottom left of the image is the ore loading station, using infinity chests and stack inserters to load, and on the top left is the plate unloading station where stack inserters take the plates and put them in an infinity chest that deletes them. The small setup that you see here produces a bit more than 1.25 blue belt of plates (or 1.33 if using speed modules instead of production).

    Here it is in action in video (speed x5):

    Buffered & beaconed train to train foundry in action (speed x5)

    I attach the blueprint of this setup to this post at the bottom (mod required: Editor Extensions for the infinity chests).

    Obviously, for a real base I would improve the train tracks and not use double headed trains, this is just for demonstration purposes. With a well thought out train network going with it, allowing trains to leave and enter easily, with good train queueing system, this could be viable?

    What do you guys think? Is this just pure insanity or am I onto something here?

    Thank you for your time and advice.

    --------------------------------------

    Blueprint:

    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