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    Factorio Weekly Question Thread

    July 17, 2021

    Factorio Weekly Question Thread

    Weekly Question Thread

    Posted: 11 Jul 2021 09:00 PM PDT

    Ask any questions you might have.

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    When it's time to get serious

    Posted: 16 Jul 2021 06:45 PM PDT

    Biters are trapped in this island. So i built a bunch of pollution producing buildings just to piss them off.

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 08:26 AM PDT

    Why is this train choosing the wrong slot in the stacker?

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 03:54 AM PDT

    Took me 8 years to launch my first rocket.

    Posted: 16 Jul 2021 04:38 PM PDT

    I played for 339 hours before I launched the rocket. Lots of restarts and experimenting. Just having fun with the game. All vanilla.

    So, I looked at the in-game day/night cycle: 416.66 seconds. The math comes out to my little engineer friend spending 8 years getting the rocket launched. Final game lasted about 72 hours.

    It's a great game.

    submitted by /u/wattotjabba
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    My army of landfillers

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 02:21 AM PDT

    This happens to me with so many things in factorio when i'm first learning them

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 05:57 AM PDT

    Gridless Defense Layout

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 01:14 AM PDT

    why are not all of my steam engines working ? i cant figure it out

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 06:33 AM PDT

    After around 180hrs I can finally play!!!

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 01:17 AM PDT

    Factorio is a hell of addicting drug.

    Currently my goal is to launch 1.000 rockets.

    On my old computer I started to do a huge megabase with robots but somehow my computer died at I was sitting at low FPS/ups

    However, the computer is done and I habe another one with same species. And I was outside 5 months from my country and thought so much before sleeping.

    Finally I can do what I was thinking of

    I wanted to do a just train base, so I came across this cityblocks. But it doesn't feel right for me, so I was thinking what to do and I came across the idea of having a HUGE central station where is also a storage. Trains are brining stuff there it gets stored and trains will pick it up to small factories.

    It took me more than 180 hours to prepare everything because I didn't plan properly, but very soon my central station is ready, I can start to build the waiting area and begin finally to play.

    I'll make a lot of rails and set up small factories for each item. It'll be similar to city blocks but with some adjustments and leaving the pattern to habe some real feeling instead of a clean sterilisation copy base.

    WISH ME LUCK MY COMPUTER WONT DIE.

    I am super excited. When I've done more progress and the first train is running I'll show some pictures.

    submitted by /u/ActualReverk
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    TIFU: Space exploration - missed a single wire a few months back and launched 30+ unnecessary rocket's, 650 roboports, 7.5k blue track, 2.2k rocket sections!!! And more!!

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 06:10 AM PDT

    A few weeks back I set up a new moon factory to create ice and a few materials. It worked wonderfully and I was very pleased.

    When I set up new planets/moons, I create a requester pad. It keeps the sub factory supplied with anything it needs to run and a buffer for new buildings and cargo launches.

    Well, double check your wires kids....

    I was working away in my space station when I realised the pop up for storage full on ice factory.

    "Huh, swear I put down like 60 storage chests"

    Turns out, I never wired the logistics network item count into the requester, essentially asking for a total restock endlessly

    submitted by /u/Agile_Ad_2234
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    Explain to me how to do this like I'm 5

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 08:41 AM PDT

    I finally give up pyMods without other mod,and it all comes together

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 01:09 AM PDT

    Trains need to be faster

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 09:20 AM PDT

    I have a moderately big base, traveling from one end of my base to another on a train takes forever, even with nuclear fuel. Factorio needs high speed railways, at least for passenger trains.

    submitted by /u/Contribution-Sharp
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    Looking for train station mod

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 07:08 AM PDT

    I'm looking for a mod I stumbled across a few weeks ago but cant remember the name of. It was a small qol mod that condensed the station list by grouping stations that share a common 1st word into collapsible sets. If any1 is familiar with this mod plz refresh my memory. Thanks!

    submitted by /u/Tonn013
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    My very first time ever getting to Blue/Black science!

    Posted: 16 Jul 2021 06:25 PM PDT

    My very first time ever getting to Blue/Black science!

    ​

    First setup ever using Blue and Black Science

    I've played this game for roughly 50 hours. I've had a dozen or so saves, and I'd always kinda just give up right when getting to blue science because there was just so much I needed to do. However, I finally just dispensed with the idea that the initial Blue/Black science needed to be fully automated. So I made exactly enough to get to Laser Turrets and Electric Furnaces so I can greatly simplify my train logistics. Then, once I have a massive solar field/accumulator setup, I'm gonna expand my perimeter and start on my very first intermediate factory (Circuits, Steel, Plates, Batteries, etc).

    submitted by /u/NicholaiRen
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    Factory Planner has come a long way (comparison with Helmod)

    Posted: 16 Jul 2021 11:53 AM PDT

    Factory Planner has come a long way (comparison with Helmod)

    I love playing Space Exploration and I always used Helmod to calculate how much production I need for each ingredient. I tried other tools to calculate the ratios in the past, but they were either designed for vanilla or really struggled with SE's highly recursive recipes.

    ​

    Helmod works well most of the time. Its matrix solver is usually good, but sometimes it just refuses to calculate what I want it to. Here's an example where I just could not achieve what I wanted with it. Here's a Significant Biomass production line:

    https://preview.redd.it/pr8mx5kkcmb71.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=cd3dd27f5ddbdb764e434e556b75cf32305a6ae2

    Note that it calculated Neural Gel as a byproduct to break even biosludge production/consumption and there's no way (that I'm aware) to tell helmod that I actually want Biosludge to be an input ingredient and I want to break even with Neural Gel production/consumption instead.

    Sometimes it helps to rearrange items in a production line (even though matrix solver is supposed to completely disrespect recipe order, it still somehow matters), but in this case it just refused to work this time.

    Last time I had this problem a couple years ago and I tried Factory Planner, but it simply did not have a matrix solver back then, so it could not handle recursive recipes at all. But in the recent version of the mod, it does! And actually it not only worked for the significant biomass production line, it worked for the entire green science production line from start to finish:

    ​

    https://preview.redd.it/7mm8bzpxdmb71.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=5028bb042e97c6630b9e1596597a168a67d59f52

    It even handles contaminated biosludge and contaminated cosmic water! If you ever tried to do this in Helmod, you know that it's practically impossible to achieve this, because Helmod really gets confused what should be a byproduct and what should be an input. But Factory Planner solved it in a perfectly sensible way: when it does not know what you want, it just asks:

    ​

    https://preview.redd.it/xa3yrtnbemb71.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=f4da7c5d55fe2fde305000eba66c85d49b404cf0

    Basically when it's ambiguous, it just asks you to tell what the input item is and presents you all possible candidates. In this case for example, the input item is obviously cosmic water and selecting it puts it into the input ingredient list. It also feels amazing to know that technically I can use whatever item from that list and it will correctly solve for that item being an input.

    ​

    There are some things that I still love from helmod: I definitely prefer two digits after dot instead of one (say, 0.16 instead of 0.1) in all numerals. I also love how in helmod you can click any input ingredient in the "Ingredients" window and it adds its recipe (in Factory Planner you must first find that ingredient in a recipe that consumes it and then click it there for some reason). I love how in Helmod you can move an item to the top of the list or bottom of the list or 5 positions up or down (in Factory Planner you can only move up or down by one position). But honestly most of those are just my old habits, and overall UI of Factory Planner makes perfect sense and is quite well-designed (I'm not a fan of many recent changes that Helmod UI underwent). By far the most important thing for me is the underlying solver and in Factory Planner it is now actually perfect for my needs.

    ​

    So I hope my experience can help other people running mods with complex production lines to give Factory Planner another chance. It has truly come a long way in the past year and has become an amazing tool to my surprise.

    submitted by /u/probably_not_a_bug
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    My newly designed Uranium Processing + Kovarex, works perfectly and supports up to about 2700 SPM for 12 GW of full nuclear power.

    Posted: 16 Jul 2021 07:37 PM PDT

    This confused, jumbled mess was my first attempt at automating production of red and green science packs...I realise now that I could have made better use of underground belts and splitters, but any tips on how to better organise this are greatly appreciated

    Posted: 16 Jul 2021 08:48 PM PDT

    The Most Efficient 9 Tiles Ribbon World Train System, possibly.

    Posted: 16 Jul 2021 11:10 AM PDT

    The Most Efficient 9 Tiles Ribbon World Train System, possibly.

    This is the continuation of the research I presented in my other post 9 Tiles Ribbon World: Making a usable train network. After testing this previous train system more extensively and as u/scorpio_72472 rightfully predicted, it turns out that this train system works, but the throughput was really slow, therefore I have worked at making an efficient train system, and I believe that I succeeded! Here is a video of the final result (speed x4):

    9 Tiles World Train System Proof of Concept

    To be able to visualise it better in video I've put this system on a normal map, but it is designed to fit on a 9 Tiles Ribbon World and it will look like this:

    The same train system on a 9 tiles high ribbon world

    Features of this train system:

    • Maximum possible throughput (explanation / proof further down this post, please correct me if I'm wrong)
    • Minimalist configuration of trains (just put station names and wait conditions as you would do normally, nothing else is needed!)
    • Stations can be used by trains coming and going from/to both sides (on a 9 tiles high ribbon world you cannot put train stations going West on the top and you cannot put stations going East on the bottom)
    • No train will ever stop in a station that is not in their schedule (so you will not have to use filter inserters even if I did in the video or wonder "what if the wrong train stop here?" because it will never happen)
    • High maximum number of trains on the train system. The maximum number of trains this system can support can be calculated with the equation: [Number of stations] + ( [Number of sidings] * 2 ) - 1
    • No circuitry shenanigans. There is only 1 wire in train stations to ensure that there is always only a maximum of 1 train per station for reasons that I explain further down.
    • Stations can be sized at the maximum size of the train coming and going from/to that specific station, not the biggest train in the system.
    • No train limits in train stops so trains will start heading to their destination right away, even if there is already a train there or on their way.

    9 Tiles high ribbon world train system constraints

    Let's go over a few facts about trains and making a train system in a 9 tiles high ribbon world:

    • There is not enough room to make a U-Turn, so we have to use double headed trains
    • Forking a train track into 2 parallel tracks takes 8 tiles so we can fork into 2 tracks
    • Because forking into 2 tracks takes 8 tiles, one of the tracks will not be able to have signals on one side, and putting signals only on one side of a track makes this track a one way track. can be solved by placing signals in the bend merging/forking the tracks.

    These points can be visualised in one image:

    9 tiles high ribbon world train system constraints

    Stations and sidings

    The train system is going to be composed of 2 major elements: Stations and sidings.

    A station is made of the track forking into 2 tracks, with one train station for trains going West on the bottom track and a station going East on the top track, with possible loading, unloading, or refueling stuff there.

    Example of station

    A siding is the track forking into 2 parallel tracks where trains can cross each other and wait for a further station or siding to become available.

    Example of siding

    Deadlocks and collisions avoidance

    Now let's think about what can cause deadlocks and collisions in a system like this:

    If we make all tracks 2 way, then we expose ourselves to deadlocks immediately. Everytime 2 trains want to go in the same direction reach 2 other trains wanting to go the opposite direction, it's a guaranteed deadlock:

    Deadlock

    This can even happen with 3 tains. In the following image the 2 trains on the right want to enter the station while the train exiting the station wants to go East, making a deadlock:

    Deadlock

    In more general terms, we expose ourselves to deadlocks if we allow 2 trains in one station or siding to go in the same direction, so we will prevent that.

    We will solve this problem completely by making each lane of a siding 1 way, this way 2 trains can use the sidings to cross each other's path but we are guaranteed that trains at sidings will not generate deadlocks. Here is a complete siding with proper signaling (top lane to go East, bottom lane to go West):

    ​

    Complete siding with signals

    Okay, now the stations. First off, I prevent 2 trains from being at the station at the same time with circuitry. The 2 train stops at a stations are linked together with circuit, the bottom station reads its train count as signal W (number of trains going Westward at this station) and the top station reads the train count as signal E). The train count is used to disable the train stop on the other direction.

    Circuitry of the train stops in one station

    If a train starts its journey towards this station, the train stop of the station in the other direction gets disabled, ensuring that there will only be 1 train stopped at the station. Note that since the train count value increases by 1 when a train STARTS its journey from another station towards it and we disable the other station based on train count, we are guaranteed that the other station will be disabled when all trains are not currently on the main train line and will not therefore block traffic.

    I started by making stations without any signal at all, just the 2 train stations to allow trains from both sides to come and go while making sure that there is never 2 trains there going in the same direction. It worked, but this was really inefficient as every time there was a train loading/unloading, the whole track (both lanes) would be made unavailable for other trains, severely impacting throughput and the other lane of the station was just empty and left unused. The solution: make both lanes in stations 2 way with repeat signals. Using a repeat signal makes sure that trains can go through the (possibly currently in use) station without stopping there and it also allow the unused lane of a station to be used by other trains both ways, allowing high throughput.

    With this system, stations are guaranteed to always have a 2-way lane available, and sidings have a 1-way lanes available for each direction, so trains can keep going in all cases without risking deadlock!

    Furthermore, this system doesn't use "U-Turn stations" like in my previous system, you can configure your trains as you would normally do, here is the configuration of the iron train from the video demonstration:

    Easy train configuration without weird trick

    Thanks to the repeat signals in stations we are guaranteed that no train will ever stop in the "wrong" station to wait, so this allows partially fully trains without risking to fill them with unwanted items.

    The sidings need to be sized to the length of the biggest train in the system, but the stations can be sized for the biggest train coming/going to that specific station.

    Note that there can be an arbitrarily long track track in between 2 station or siding.

    For best results I advise to always put a siding on both sides of a station.

    Every time the rails merge back after/before a station or siding you can take the track back on the edge of the map in your 9 tiles high ribbon world so you have 7 tiles available for your factories!

    Please let me know if I missed something and deadlocks/collisions are possible or if there is anything else that might increase throughput.

    Download blueprint.

    Thank you all reading my post!

    ---------------------------------

    Other "9 Tiles Ribbon World Challenge" posts of mine:

    Insane Ribbon World 9 Tiles Challenge: My 7 tiles high mall (Work in Progress)

    9 Tiles Ribbon World: Pushing nuclear to its absolute limits! (465MW)

    submitted by /u/Pierr0x
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    Help with transport drone mod control

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 03:41 AM PDT

    I've been pondering a problem for a while. If i have several sources of the dame material how do i go about prioritising one depot over another. .e.g. in SE i want to use all the coal (say) from core mining, before using any from my railway station which pulls it in from outposts.

    1st idea was to read the road network and disable the railway depot if the value was over a certain amount. This tended, however, to cause a flashing as the depot went " not enough enable myself" the reader would read that and then the depot would go " too much, turn off"

    2nd idea which I've just thought of is to control the input belt from the train to the depot. Only allowing it to run when the stuff is below a certain value. Not tried it yet but i could see a problem with lag.

    Anyone else solved this problem? And how did you do it?

    submitted by /u/Ricardo440440
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    Is there a way to detect which way a train will go?

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 03:27 AM PDT

    So i've only been playing for 2 weeks (i bought the game a few years ago but didn't play it until my friend got it too 2 weeks ago) and now i've started designing smart junctions for the rail system, and i want to make them entirely crash safe, but to do that optimally (without blocking unnecessary tracks) i have to know where each train will go, with merges that's possible, and if i have only 1 split i can just give that last priority but if i have for example a 3 way junction then every way starts with a split...

    Our train system uses 10 carriage trains, so if i have to detect where a train goes after a split every junction wil be huge...

    Edit: haha yellow signals exist my entire system was right, i just didn't know yellow existed...

    submitted by /u/Jucox
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    POV: Those remote Roboports need some juice...

    Posted: 17 Jul 2021 08:31 AM PDT

    Hit 1kspm - where to go from here?

    Posted: 16 Jul 2021 11:42 PM PDT

    After about 220hrs on one map (three separate base builds) I finally got a stable 1kspm base. And… I'm totally out of ideas. What do people do when they get here?

    For info, each science production is separate, ores/raw materials transported by train but nothing else. Minimal logistics for non-construction activities.

    submitted by /u/WeRegretToInform
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